Posts Tagged ‘irrevocable trust’

Husband’s Interest in Trust Not Divided in Divorce Proceedings

AUGUST 22, 2016 VOLUME 23 NUMBER 31
Carl and Debbie (not their real names) were married, and have two children together. After more than a decade together, Carl filed for a divorce in their home state of Massachusetts.

In the course of the divorce action, the court was required to divide Carl and Debbie’s assets equitably. But what would that mean for the trust established for Carl by his father back in the early years of the couple’s marriage?

Carl’s father had set up the trust to make distributions to Carl, his two siblings, his children, nieces and nephews. Debbie was not named as a beneficiary of the trust, and distributions could not be made to her. Over a two-year period just before the marriage ended, Carl had received over $800,000 in distributions from the trust. At the time of the divorce trial, the trust was valued at almost $25 million; Carl was one of eleven potential beneficiaries of the trust.

The divorce court had to figure out what to do about the trust. Noting that it provided for payments for Carl’s “comfortable support, health, maintenance, welfare and education,” the divorce judge decided that Debbie should be entitled to a share of the trust.

Calculating that Carl’s one-eleventh interest in the trust would be about $2.2 million, the divorce judge assigned 60% of that figure to Debbie. Carl appealed; the Massachusetts Court of Appeals affirmed the divorce judge’s determination. Carl appealed again, this time to the Massachusetts Supreme Court.

The state’s high court disagreed, and reversed the award of an interest in the trust to Debbie. Part of the reason for the reversal: the trust included a spendthrift provision, which should prohibit any claim by third persons against Carl’s interest. The justices also noted that Carl was not one of the trustees of the trust (his brother and one of his father’s lawyers were trustees), that Carl’s interest was not a separate share of the trust (it provided that distributions could be unequal and, in fact, no distributions had yet been made to or for second-generation beneficiaries), and that no distributions had been made to Carl since the divorce petition was filed (though distributions had continued to his two siblings).

Because of the exact nature of the trust, the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court ruled that Carl’s interest in the trust was not available to be assigned to his wife in the divorce proceedings. The court did note, however, that when the divorce judge reconsiders the division of property, she might want to assign more of the couple’s assets to Debbie because of Carl’s potential benefits flowing from the trust. Pfannenstiehl v. Pfannenstiehl, August 4, 2016.

Many of our clients are concerned about the scenario in Carl and Debbie’s situation — but from the other side of the equation. If you want to leave some of your property to your child, but worry about the possibility of divorce or other marital problems, what can (or should) you do?

Arizona, of course, is a community property state. That means that everything a married couple acquires during the marriage is presumed to belong equally to both spouses. One huge exception to that general rule: gifts and inheritances.

If you give or leave money to your married daughter in Arizona, it is not community property. It remains her separate property — unless, of course, she converts it to community property by putting her spouse’s name on the title (that’s not the only way to convert it into community property, but it’s the most common one).

What about leaving property to your daughter in a trust? That should help protect it even better against her spouse — and her other creditors. It’s hard to explain the original divorce judge in Carl and Debbie’s case, or the Court of Appeals decision that upheld it, but the final outcome should clearly be the one adopted by the high court in Massachusetts. A trust for your daughter should not figure in her later divorce — though it is possible to imagine that her divorce court judge might award slightly more of the couple’s property to her spouse if she has ready access to a substantial trust account.

Does it make any difference who is named as trustee of your daughter’s trust? The court in Carl and Debbie’s case thought it was worth noting that Carl was not the trustee of his own trust, but the outcome should not have been different if he had been. A trustee has a duty to all of the potential beneficiaries, and therefore can’t just act in their own interest. That means that even if Carl had been trustee (or co-trustee) of the trust established by his father, his access to the trust’s principal would have been limited.

Would it make a difference if there were other compelling financial concerns involved? It should not, and in that regard it might be worth noting that Debbie’s earning potential was found to be substantially less than Carl’s, and that the couple’s daughter is a Down Syndrome child.

Should it matter whether a trust beneficiary has a history of relying on the trust? It probably does not — note that Carl and Debbie more than doubled their earnings in the years in which the trust made distributions.

Are you concerned by the possibility that an inheritance you leave to your child might become an element in a future divorce proceeding? Talk to your estate planning attorney about your options, and don’t be surprised if you find yourself discussing a trust arrangement.

Definitions For Common Estate Planning Terms

FEBRUARY 3, 2014 VOLUME 21 NUMBER 5

Judging from the questions we field online and from clients, there is a lot of confusion about some of the basic terms commonly used in estate planning. We thought maybe we could do a service (and make our own explanations a little easier) by collecting some of the more-common ones — and defining them. Feel free to suggest additional terms or quibble with our definitions:

Will — this is the starting point for estate planning. It is the document by which you declare who will receive your property, and who will be in charge of handling your estate. Note, though, that if you have a “living trust” (see below), your will may actually be the least important document in your estate planning bundle.

Personal representative — this is the person you put in charge of probating your estate. It is an umbrella of a name, encompassing what we used to call executors, executrixes, administrators, administratrixes and other, less-common, terms. If you use one of the old-fashioned terms in your will, that probably won’t be a problem — we’ll just call them your “personal representative” when the time comes. Note that your personal representative has absolutely no authority until you have died and your will has been admitted to probate.

Devisee — that’s what we call each of the people (or organizations) your will names as receiving something.

Heir — if you didn’t have a will, your relatives would take your property in a specified order (see “intestate succession” below). The people who would get something if you hadn’t signed a will are your “heirs.” Note that some people can be both heirs and devisees.

Intestate succession — every state has a rule of intestate succession, and they are mostly pretty similar. The list of relatives is your legislature’s best guess of who most people would want to leave their estates to. Think of it as a sort of a default will — in Arizona, for instance, the principles of intestate succession are set out in Arizona Revised Statutes Title 14, Chapter 2, Article 1, beginning with section 14-2101 (keep clicking on “next document” to scroll through the relevant statutes).

Escheat — that’s the term lawyers use to describe the situation where you leave no close relatives, or all the people named in your will have died before you. Escheat is very, very rare, incidentally. Note that the Arizona statute eschews “escheat” in favor of “unclaimed estate.” There is a different, but related, concept in the statutes, too: if an heir or devisee exists but can’t be found, the property they would receive can be distributed to the state to be held until someone steps forward to claim their share. That is not an unclaimed estate, but an unclaimed asset.

Pourover will — when you create a living trust (see below), you usually mean to avoid having your estate go through probate at all. If everything works just right your will won’t ever be filed, and no probate proceeding will be necessary. Just in case, though, we will probably have you sign a will that leaves everything to your trust — we hope not to use it, but if we have to then the will directs that all of your assets be poured into the trust.

Trust — a trust is a separate entity, governed by its own rules and providing (usually) for who will receive assets or income upon the happening of specified events. Think of a trust as a sort of corporation (though of course it is not, and it is not subject to all of the rules governing corporations). It owns property and has an operating agreement — the trust document itself. There are a lot of different types of trusts, and usually the names are just shorthand ways of describing some of the trust’s characteristics.

Testamentary trust — the first kind of trust, and the oldest, is a trust created in a will. Of course, a testamentary trust will not exist until your estate has been probated, so it is of no use in any attempt to avoid probate. But  you can put a trust provision in your will so that any property going to particular beneficiaries will be managed according to rules you spell out. Testamentary trusts are relatively rare these days, but they still have a place in some estate plans.

Living trust — pretty much any trust that is not a testamentary trust can be called a living trust. The term really just means that the trust exists during the life of the person establishing the trust. If you sign a trust declaration or agreement, and you transfer no assets (or nominal assets) to it but provide that it will receive an insurance payout, or a share of your probate estate, it is still a living trust — it is just an unfunded living trust until assets arrive.

Trustee — this is the person who is in charge of a trust. Usually we say “trustee” for the person who is in charge now, and “successor trustee” for the person who will take over when some event (typically the death, resignation or incapacity of the current trustee) occurs. There can, of course, be co-trustees — multiple trustees with shared authority. Sometimes co-trustee are permitted to act independently, and sometimes they must all act together (or a majority of them must agree). The trust document should spell out which approach will apply, and how everyone will know that the successor trustee or trustees have taken over.

Grantor trust — this is a term mostly used in connection with the federal income tax code, but sometimes used more widely. In tax law, it means that the trust will be ignored for income tax purposes, and the grantor (or grantors) will be treated as owning the assets directly. Most living trusts funded during the life of the person signing the trust will be grantor trusts — but not all of them. Outside of tax settings the term “grantor trust” is often used more loosely, and it can sometimes mean any living trust whose grantor is still alive.

Revocable trust — means exactly what it sounds like. Someone (usually, but not always, the person who established the trust) has the power to revoke the trust. Sometimes that includes the power to designate where trust assets will go, but usually the trust just provides that upon revocation the assets go back to the person who contributed them to the trust.

Irrevocable trust — a trust that is not a revocable trust. Oddly, though, a trust can have “revocable” in its name and be irrevocable — if, for example, Dave and Sally Jones create the “Jones Family Revocable Trust,” it probably becomes irrevocable after Dave and Sally die. Its name doesn’t change, however.

Special needs trust — any trust with provisions for dealing with the actual or potential disability of a beneficiary can be said to be a special needs trust. Usually, but not always, a special needs trust is designed to provide benefits for someone who is on Supplemental Security Income (SSI), Social Security Disability (SSD) or other government programs. Sometimes the money comes from the beneficiary, and sometimes from family members or others wanting to provide for the beneficiary.

There’s more. A lot more, actually. Has this been helpful? Let us know and we’ll add to it in coming weeks. In the meantime, a reminder: ask your estate planning lawyer for help with these concepts. Don’t be embarrassed that they seem complicated — they are complicated.

EINs for Trusts: The Questions Just Keep Pouring In

APRIL 16, 2012 VOLUME 19 NUMBER 15
Tax ID numbers for trusts. When we first wrote about this topic, we did not appreciate how interested our readers would be. We thought that the issue was sort of dry, actually, and that most people would have asked their lawyer or their accountant for direction. It has become one of the most enduringly popular topics at the Fleming & Curti, PLC, website.

Imagine our surprise. The questions just keep coming. We can’t and don’t try to answer them all individually — we are not here to give free legal advice based on incomplete information, and most of the questions leave out at least some of the detail we would need. But we do find your questions instructive for purposes of figuring out the level of interest — and confusion — out there.

Here are a few of the questions we have gotten (edited for space, or to focus the question on the area we want to answer). Please, please, please remember that we are not trying to give specific legal advice here — we only want to help you focus your questions for when you talk with your own lawyer, or when you find yourself arguing with the well-meaning but misinformed support person at a major mutual fund company.

My parents set up a living trust as joint trustees and used my fathers SSN Dad died, Mom survives but is incapacitated, I am the successor trustee. Do I need to get a new TIN?

The key to determining when a trust needs its own EIN (employer identification number — the correct term for a taxpayer identification number for a non-human entity) is whether or not the trust is a “grantor” trust. While your parents were both living the trust was probably revocable and for their joint benefit; it almost certainly could use one or the other parent’s Social Security Number as its TIN. With the death of your father, the question now is whether the trust (a) is still revocable and (b) contains money that was originally your mother’s.

For purposes of determining the trust’s revocability, we can ignore the fact that your mother may not be mentally able to revoke the trust. The test is whether she would have the legal authority to do so, were she competent to attempt it.

More importantly, if the trust consisted of your father’s property (and not joint or community property), then it may not be a grantor trust any longer. In that case it may need its own EIN.

Whether or not it needs to have its own EIN, it is permissible for you to get one. This is true because your mother is no longer the trustee. Many banks and brokerage houses think that the fact that she is not trustee makes a separate EIN mandatory; they are wrong. But there is no harm in getting one, and it might make it easier to deal with the financial industry. What the tax returns would look like in such a case is a separate question — one you probably ought to pose to the accountant who prepares the trust’s and your mother’s tax returns.

What name do you give the “new” trust created after the death of a spouse?

The most common scenario is this: husband and wife have either a joint revocable trust or reciprocal trusts. In either case, upon the death of the first spouse a separate trust is created for the benefit of the surviving spouse. This trust is irrevocable and contains assets that belonged originally to the now-deceased spouse. As we have described before, this new trust (it might be more accurate to call it a modification of the old trust, which is now irrevocable) needs its own EIN. But what is it called?

The trust document itself might give the answer. Mr. and Mrs. Jones’ trust might say something like “the share described herein shall be set aside into the Jones Family Trust Marital Sub-Trust” or “the Jones Family Decedent’s Trust.” If the document names the new (or sub-) trust, use that name. If not, we usually use language that makes clear — and helps us remember — what kind of trust it is. Perhaps “the Jones Family Trust — Decedent’s Share” is clear enough.

There is no particular magic to the language. Clarity is the key. There are no trust policemen waiting to arrest you for getting the name wrong, and sometimes it is easier to let the broker or banker win these arguments — even when they are wrong. But if you are trustee it IS important that you keep track of which funds belong to which sub-trust if there is more than one, and that you not commingle the money between trusts or, worse yet, with your own money.

I have my own revocable living trust, and I know it does not need a new EIN — it uses my Social Security Number. But I’m getting claim forms from the annuity company after my mother’s death, and they want me to have a trust EIN. The form lists the EIN in the xx-xxxxxxx format rather than xxx-xx-xxxx. Can I just put my Social Security Number in that odd format?

Yes, that is what we would do. It likely will work — not so much because there is a clearly right answer, but because there is no easy way for the annuity company to double-check. Their form is wrong to assume that all trusts have an EIN, and you are not even permitted to get an EIN for your revocable trust when you are the trustee and the original owner of all its assets. We encourage you to put your Social Security Number in the xx-xxxxxxx format and see if it works. We have done that before and it has.

I have a trust within my Will naming my son as beneficiary and directing my niece, the trustee, as to when to make distributions. Does she need a EIN?

She certainly will when you die. Until then, the trust doesn’t really exist, so there’s nothing to apply for now.

This suggests a question not really asked: what happens when you die with a will creating a trust? The first part of the answer: we will need to probate your estate. If your intention was to avoid probate by creating a trust, putting it in your will does not accomplish that. We see much confusion about this point among our clients and audiences when we give public presentations. Sometimes they then say something like: “ah, but we took care of that problem — we named our son as POD beneficiary” (or, sometimes, as joint tenant with right of survivorship). Great — no probate. Also — no trust. If you want your son’s money to pass in trust AND to avoid probate, you will need to talk about creating a living trust, not a testamentary trust. But that’s a lecture for another day.

Those were fun questions, but we’re out of time and space for this week’s newsletter installment. But keep sending them in — your questions help us decide where to focus our future articles. Please remember, however, that we are not here to give specific legal advice — we look for questions that raise larger questions that help us explain legal concepts for a lay audience. We hope we have helped you understand exactly why you need a lawyer for your more specific legal question.

Remainder Beneficiaries Not Entitled to Trust Beneficiary’s Financial Info

SEPTEMBER 12, 2011 VOLUME 18 NUMBER 32
Imagine with us for a moment: you are the trustee of an irrevocable trust created by a now-deceased woman for the benefit of her daughter. The trust says that her daughter is to receive all the income generated by the trust. You are also given the discretion to give the daughter some of the trust’s principal if she needs it. When the daughter dies, whatever is left in the trust will go to her nieces and nephews, the grandchildren of the original trust settlor.

You have just gotten a letter from the daughter, asking you for an additional $3,000 per month to pay for her care. You know that the remainder beneficiaries — the nieces and nephews — might object to that extra distribution. What should you do?

That is essentially the problem faced by Citigroup Trust, which is trustee of just such a trust. It was established by Esther Caplan for the benefit of her daughter, and it is administered in Arizona. After Citigroup began making regular distributions to the daughter, one of her nephews questioned whether the trustee should be giving her additional funds. Eric Bistrow told Citigroup that he wanted more information about his aunt’s finances, and that he wondered whether the trust was funding a too-lavish standard of living.

To make sure that they understood the daughter’s needs, Citigroup requested (and got) tax returns and a budget. They decided to keep making the distributions, but also to ask the Arizona courts for direction.

Citigroup filed what in Arizona trust law is called a “Petition for Instructions.” They essentially asked the probate judge to tell them whether they were right to make the discretionary distributions of principal.

In the course of the proceedings, Mr. Bistrow and his attorney asked to look at his aunt’s budget, tax returns and financial information. Citigroup declined, saying that the information was private and should not be shared. How, then, would Mr. Bistrow know that they had properly considered her financial needs? The trustee suggested that it would give the records to the probate judge, and let him review them privately; if there were concerns or questions, the judge could make the decision to share them, or some portion of them.

The probate judge agreed, looked at the records, and approved the past and proposed future distributions to Ms. Caplan’s daughter. It also confirmed that Mr. Bistrow and the other nephews and nieces were entitled to statements showing how much was actually distributed, as well as how much was earned by the trust and what other expenses it incurred.

The nieces and nephews appealed, arguing that they were not being given enough input into the decision to distribute trust principal to their aunt. Their position was that they should be notified before any distributions could be made, that they should be given full financial information, and that they should be given an opportunity to weigh in on their aunt’s need for funds.

Not so, ruled the Arizona Court of Appeals. Mr. Bistrow and the other remainder beneficiaries are entitled to be treated fairly. They are entitled to know what the trustee is doing. They are entitled to ask the courts to intervene if they think the trustee has exceeded its authority. They are not, however, entitled to see their aunt’s financial records, or to vote on whether the trustee should exercise its discretion to make distributions to her. In Re the Matter of Esther Caplan Trust, September 1, 2011.

The Caplan case is focused on a narrow question, but it has broader application. It also raises (but does not answer) a number of interesting questions. It gives important guidance to trustees on how to safely exercise the discretion given by a trust document.

What are some of the lessons of Caplan? A few come to mind:

  1. Asking for court review of decisions which might be challenged should always be considered. It may be that the amount in controversy is too small to justify court involvement, or that the trustee’s decision is simply unassailable, or that the remainder beneficiaries are agreeable. But in any case in which there might be disagreement, the Petition for Instructions is a good safeguard for the trustee.
  2. Remainder beneficiaries are important, and their interests need to be considered in administering a trust. But the income beneficiary’s interest is usually paramount. Remainder beneficiaries are not in charge of trust administration.
  3. Notwithstanding that remainder beneficiaries are not in charge, they are still entitled to sufficient information so that they can determine if their interests are being adequately protected. But “sufficient information” is not the same thing as “complete information.” It may sometimes (rarely, but occasionally) be appropriate for a trustee to withhold sensitive or personal information. Usually, it would be wise to identify the information which is not being shared, so that the remainder beneficiaries can make a reasoned decision about whether to challenge that determination, too.
  4. Creative thinking can come up with solutions that protect everyone’s interests and violate none. Giving the judge a chance to review the financial records in camera (privately) was just such a creative solution.

More on Types of Trusts — Some of the Less Common Varieties

JANUARY 24, 2011 VOLUME 18 NUMBER 3
Last week we wrote about different types of trusts you might have encountered, and tried to explain some of the generic terms, differences among and between types, and likely settings where a given type of trust might be appropriate. We wrote about spendthrift trusts, bypass trusts, special needs trusts and the difference between revocable and irrevocable trusts. Let’s see if we can clear up some of the confusion over less-common trust names.

Crummey trusts. In 1962 Californian Dr. Clifford Crummey created a trust for the benefit of his four children, who then ranged in age from 11 to 22. He was trying to address a problem with estate tax law: he could give the money to his children outright (and then worry about how they spent it) or put it in trust for them to protect it (but then not get it out of his own estate for estate tax purposes). His clever idea: put the money in a trust for each kid’s benefit, but give that child the right to withdraw his “gift” from the trust until the end of the year. When they didn’t exercise that right (hey — the youngest was only 11, and even the oldest would understand that withdrawing his money might affect future gifts) it would lapse, and the gift would be completed but stay in trust.

The Internal Revenue Service thought it was a trick, and they argued that Dr. Crummey and his wife had not made gifts at all. The IRS lost that argument, and the “Crummey” trust was born, in a 1968 decision by the U.S. Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. If you’d like to read the actual decision in Crummey v. Commissioner you may — but we warn you that it will be interesting to only a few diehards, most of them lawyers or accountants.

For nearly a half-century, then, the Crummey trust has been a primary tool in the estate planner’s toolbox. The trusts have morphed over time — now they are often used to purchase life insurance (and may be called Irrevocable Life Insurance Trusts, or ILITs). The length of time for a beneficiary to withdraw the funds has been shortened in most cases — often to a month and sometimes even less. Some practitioners even give the withdrawal right to people other than the primary trust beneficiary. The Crummey trust in each case is an irrevocable trust intended to get a gift out of the donor’s estate for tax purposes but into a trust to control the use of the money after the gift is completed. With the present high gift tax exemption in federal law ($5 million for 2011 and 2012) the use of Crummey trusts will probably diminish appreciably.

Generation-Skipping trusts. In the simplest sense, a GST (practitioners love acronyms) is any trust that continues for more than one generation of beneficiaries. The “current” generation, if you will, might or might not have the right to receive income, or access to principal, of the trust — but it will continue until at least the death of that current generation representative.

GSTs are often constructed to skip multiple generations. The model for the maintenance of accumulated family wealth is usually the Rockefeller family — some of the trusts established by John D. Rockefeller before his 1937 death and valued collectively at over $1.4 billion at the time — are still chugging along for the benefit of his descendants.

Because of concerns about the accumulation of family wealth, and the avoidance of estate taxes in multiple generations by the use of such trusts, the federal government in 1976 introduced a new GST taxation scheme. More recent changes in the GST tax have driven the types, terms and use of GSTs. The GST tax is very high, but only applies (as of 2011 — the rules may change in two years or thereafter) to “skips” of over $5 million. Very elaborate GSTs are sometimes marketed as Dynasty trusts. One common problem in addition to tax issues: the common-law “Rule Against Perpetuities” may make it difficult to extend trusts for multiple generations. In Arizona it is now at least theoretically possible to extend a trust over more than 500 years without facing problems with the Rule. That is a sobering thought when you consider that 500 years ago the land that was to become Arizona was all but unknown to ancestors of the Europeans, Asians, Africans and even many Native Americans who live here now.

QTIP trusts. QTIP stands for “Qualified Terminable Interest Property.” Does that explain the trust type? Well, not quite.

In very general terms, a QTIP trust is probably designed for one narrow purpose. It permits a wealthy spouse to leave property for the benefit of a less-well-off surviving spouse without consuming the deceased spouse’s full estate tax exemption amount. In other words: if you were worth, say, $10 million dollars in 2009, when the estate tax exemption was at $3.5 million, you might have left $3.5 million to your adult children from your first marriage and most of the rest of your property in a QTIP trust for your second husband (or wife). That way your estate would pay no estate tax, and the tax would be due on the death of the surviving spouse. Since he (or she) had no property in our example, that means that his (or her) $3.5 million exemption would get used on your property first, and only the excess would be subject to taxation as it passed to your children from the first marriage.

As you can see, it is getting harder and harder to make a QTIP trust a good planning opportunity, except for extremely large estates with very high disparity in net worth between the spouses. But the QTIP trust isn’t dead yet — uncertainty about the federal estate tax, continued state estate taxes in some states (but not Arizona) and inertia preventing modification of older estate plans will all contribute to keeping the QTIP alive for a few more years, at least.

We don’t know about you, but we’re exhausted. Maybe we’ll tackle some more trust types on another day. Suggestions? Do you want to know about QDoTs (sometimes called QDTs or QDOTs)? QDisTs (Qualified Disability Trusts)? Cristofani Trusts? Just ask, and we’ll take a run at them.

Conservator May Be Able To Act As Successor Trustee

AUGUST 16, 2010 VOLUME 17 NUMBER 26
Let’s say you have created a revocable living trust, and you have named yourself as trustee. You also name your two children as successor trustees, to act together upon your death or incapacity. Two years later you become incapacitated; because of a dispute between your two children about who should handle assets outside the trust, the probate court names a local bank as your conservator. Now who handles your trust — the bank, or your children?

Before we answer that question, let us complicate it. You are also the beneficiary of a trust set up by your late husband — and you are trustee of that trust, as well. About half of the assets the two of you owned are included in each of the two trusts. Your husband’s trust names you as trustee (now that he is deceased) and names the two children as successor trustees if anything should happen to you. Does your conservator have any authority over that trust?

Those were precisely the questions faced by a probate judge in South Dakota when Evelyn Didier became incapacitated. The bank appointed as her conservator asked the court to clarify that it had control over both trusts as well as Ms. Didier’s non-trust assets. The judge agreed, and Ms. Didier’s daughter Barbara Didier-Stager appealed.

Court appointment of a conservator does not amount to appointment of a successor trustee, argued Ms. Didier’s daughter. In fact, appointment of a conservator proves the incapacity that triggers a change in trustees — resulting in the son and daughter taking over as successor trustee of their mother’s trust. As to their father’s trust, the successor trustee provisions are triggered by the conservatorship in the same way — though our simplified version of the facts described above fails to clarify that the successor trustees of that trust were actually Ms. Didier-Stager and another local bank — different from the bank acting as Ms. Didier’s conservator.

South Dakota, like Arizona, has adopted the Uniform Probate Code — though South Dakota’s version has been updated more recently and is more current. The Code includes provisions about guardianship and conservatorship (though now those sections have been set aside as a separate uniform law, the Uniform Guardianship and Protective Proceedings Act). Those uniform laws permit the judge in a conservatorship proceeding to enter orders related to the protected person’s estate plan.

So, reasoned the South Dakota court, the probate court could permit Ms. Didier’s conservator to do anything that Ms. Didier herself could have done before becoming incapacitated. Her own trust was revocable and amendable — if she had wanted to do so, she could have changed the successor trustee at any time. She could have named the bank that was ultimately appointed as her conservator. Consequently, the court could allow her conservator to assume the powers of successor trustee over that trust.

The late Mr. Didiers trust was a different matter, however. Ms. Didier herself did not have the power to change the trustee, and so her conservator could not exercise that power on her behalf. That trust would have to be dealt with separately, and the Supreme Court ordered the case remanded to the probate judge to determine what to do about Mr. Didier’s trust. Conservatorship of Didier, June 30, 2010.

Does this mean that Mr. Didier’s successor trustees automatically take over, instead of Mrs. Didier’s conservator? Probably not. Other provisions of the Probate Code give the probate judge authority over trust administration, and if it appears that there is some reason not to allow the named successors to become trustee there will presumably be an order to that effect. But it does change the discussion from a choice between blindly following the document or giving Mrs. Didier’s conservator power to do anything she could do. Instead, the probate court will have to determine which approach is most consistent with the trust, with proper administration, and with the best interests of the trust’s beneficiaries.

The Uniform law actually goes quite a bit further today than the 1974 version originally adopted in Arizona (though Arizona has updated portions of the law several times). Reviewing the statute in the context of the Didier case highlights some of the changes. Among the powers given to conservators by the “new” Code (as adopted in South Dakota, for instance) is the power to “make, amend, or revoke the protected person’s will.” (See Section 411(a)(7) of the Uniform Guardianship and Protective Proceedings Act.) Court approval is required, but the very notion of a conservator changing the protected person’s estate plan might strike some as dangerous.

Do You Need a New Tax ID Number for Your Living Trust?

AUGUST 17, 2009  VOLUME 16, NUMBER 51

Imagine that you are trying to change the title on your bank account into the name of the living trust you and your spouse just set up. The nice lady at the bank is telling you that you need to get a new tax identification number for the trust. Could she be right? In a word, no.

Because we are lawyers, however, it is very hard for us to answer a complex question with a single word. So let us review some of the variations with you.

Is your trust revocable? This is the easiest variation. Give the bank (and your credit union, and your broker) your Social Security number. Joint trust between you and your spouse? No problem. Give them either Social Security number — just like before, when both of your names were on the account as individuals.

What if the trust is irrevocable? This is a little more confusing, but ultimately the answer is probably the same. If you receive any significant benefit from the trust, and your money went into it in the first place, you still use your Social Security number.

Is someone else the trustee of your trust? The answer is still the same — though many bank and brokerage officers will insist that this is what makes it mandatory for you to get a separate tax number. Simply put, they are wrong. If the trust is revocable use your Social Security number regardless of who the trustee might be. If it is irrevocable and someone else is the trustee, but you still receive benefits from the trust, use your Social Security number.

What if the trust is a “special needs” trust set up with your personal injury settlement or other funds? You still use your Social Security number. The “special needs” designation does not change the answer.

What about the “special needs” trust you set up with your money but for the benefit of your child? Now we’re getting interesting. Can you revoke the trust? What happens if your child dies before you do — does the money return to you? In either case, you probably use your Social Security number, and report the income on your tax return. Talk to your accountant and/or lawyer — don’t accept the banker’s (or broker’s) analysis of the legal and tax implications.

Is there ever a time when a new tax ID number is required for a trust? Yes, though the circumstances requiring a separate number are not as numerous as most bank officers, brokers and (for that matter) accountants think. These are not the only situations requiring a new number, but the three most common are:

  1. Life insurance trusts, or so-called “Crummey” trusts. Just because your trust owns life insurance it does not automatically follow that this special rule applies, but if it was set up precisely to own life insurance, and you are not the trustee, it likely needs its own number.
  2. A trust that becames irrevocable because of the death of the person setting the the trust up in the first place. This can happen when one spoue dies and a trust becomes partly irrevocable, too.
  3. A special needs trusts you set up (with your money) for the benefit of someone else, but which does not revert to you if the beneficiary dies before you — especially if you are not even the trustee.

When a separate number is required, what kind of number is it? The actual name for a tax identification number for a trust is “Employer Identification Number” or EIN. That is true even though the trust may not have any employees. The common acronym “TIN” (tax identification number) is not really an IRS or Social Security term at all — it is usually used as an umbrella term to encompass both EINs and Social Security numbers.

Why do bankers and stockbrokers insist that I need a new tax ID number if I do not? We’re puzzled, too. Our best answer: they are reading from a prepared list of choices, and they do not really understand the reasoning behind the various categories and approaches. We have had good experience talking with the bank employee on behalf of our clients, but sometimes it requires working up through the levels of authority.

Did you already get an EIN (Employer Identification Number) for your trust? Is that a problem? Probably not. You have two choices: change the tax identification number on all the accounts back to your Social Security number and file a final income tax return for the trust, or file annual tax returns under the trust’s EIN but without including any income or expenses — list those on your own tax return instead.

There is a lot of confusion in the financial industry about tax identification numbers and trusts. Feel free to print this out and take it to your banker.

©2017 Fleming & Curti, PLC